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February 16, 2003 03:00 pm ET - research by DroidMage
Droid gets off his butt! Aden revealed!
Aden has been released. Qwazin, Amer, Firewave and myself have been hard at work bringing you lot's of new content in the ep.12 before it hits the live server. While the others have been concentrating on catching those new bosses and testing the new drops I haven't really been that hard, I've been more sitting back and eating popcorn ;). Fortunately for everyone I've managed to put together a compilation of new bosses, monsters, areas and what have you. Sit back, enjoy and look at the pictures

First off since Aden orange potions prices have been changed to 200a. Confirmation from Captsturm revealed that they will be staying like this. Why? To generate more income for castles now that the new taxation system is in play.

The Aden Trading NPC will be here but right now it is currently inactive.


Being one of the ones to end the first Ancient Giant on test here's a quick little bit of info. He drops blessed and non blessed scrolls of enchant weapon and armor, a variety of gems, potions from condensed potions to blessed potions and also the Ancient Giant's Ring (which was not dropped first kill).

As Amer said before the Gelatinous Cubes are very easy to tame but also are very strong. Two Gelatinous Cubes can take down one Lava Golem a little bit slower then two King Bug Bears.

Giants in this episode don't generally drop well. Ranging from 100a-400a in drops they give fair experience which makes up for their low drops (I guess). As shown (from my experience) some hit harder then others. [We're still determining if this is just in Droid's mind, or if they're actually different -- as you know the Minotaurs with same name are different strength on FI, so he might be onto something.. -amer]

The husky is quite a foe when put in ring with a doberman. Coming at level 6 with an average 25 health points it can do from 4-12 damage on a elf with -1 AC. Its speed and walking compare well with a doberman, new favorite pet? I think so. [It's still not quite as strong as a dob -amer]

Currently Lindvior is spawning but at random times. He spawns in the Scar of Lindvior (located in Aden).


Aden sewers are exactly like Heine Dungeon except they have Gelatinous Cubes. You can use the sewers to go to the Tower of Isolence (convieniently named ToI on test).

Feel like taking a shot at Lindvior? Better read this before you go and lose some experience.

More to come.. ^^

February 16, 2003 03:01 pm ET (#1)
LUDACRISS
Loyal Fan

41 posts
02-08-03

Looks fun

February 16, 2003 03:05 pm ET (#2)
forciano
Loyal Fan

120 posts
10-01-02

cool

February 16, 2003 03:06 pm ET (#3)
Jailrune
Loyal Fan

60 posts
05-25-02

there is a Husky vs Doberman test on korean fansite. Husky hits little weaker than Doberman, but has good hp. And in higher level, Husky dominates Doberman.

February 16, 2003 03:07 pm ET (#4)
Etikilam
Loyal Fan

381 posts
02-12-02

So giants only drop adena T_T?

February 16, 2003 03:12 pm ET (#5)
iceman
Loyal Fan

18 posts
10-12-02

awsome i cant wait to giant hunt and then go insolence and then mess with scare and then im outta ideas...

February 16, 2003 03:14 pm ET (#6)
mp3
Loyal Fan

193 posts
02-12-02

Giants are good exp for elves. Same exp as fire archer i think, but they are really slow and dont shoot back, kaka

February 16, 2003 03:30 pm ET (#7)
87
Loyal Fan

444 posts
11-28-02

ep 12 is making me horny o.o

February 16, 2003 03:46 pm ET (#8)
GBMage
Loyal Fan

21 posts
10-22-02

What do the jello cubes drop ????

LOL #7 !!!

If giants drop 100-400a on test then expect 50-75a on live server =(

February 16, 2003 03:53 pm ET (#9)
amer
LC Admin

864 posts
07-11-01

Jailrune, please post or email URL to me at amer@lineagecompendium.com so we can take a look :)

February 16, 2003 03:57 pm ET (#10)
Bardee
Loyal Fan

125 posts
09-29-02

Nooo don't change Oranges to 200a >< Are they 200a just in Aden town or in every town? If in every town that sucks ><

February 16, 2003 03:58 pm ET (#11)
XCollicoX
Loyal Fan

131 posts
04-20-02

haha droid finally got off of his butt! o.o

February 16, 2003 04:21 pm ET (#12)
Vulgaria
Loyal Fan

84 posts
10-28-02

its 200a in every town and lindvior is up go check it out o.O

February 16, 2003 04:25 pm ET (#13)
SkyLin
Loyal Fan

82 posts
04-20-02

pfft i solo linv like 10 secs for like 3 times already
tell me how to change tga to jpg n i give ya some nice screen shots
he is up on test btw

February 16, 2003 04:29 pm ET (#14)
DragonX
Loyal Fan

65 posts
09-17-02

lind is up now on test

February 16, 2003 04:36 pm ET (#15)
ProgressionFromDep
Loyal Fan

109 posts
01-04-03

lindvior o.o he looks scary but he suck for a dragon ^^;;

February 16, 2003 04:41 pm ET (#16)
Carrington
Loyal Fan

133 posts
10-08-01

maybe all the damn elfs in fire valley will leave and go hunt giants so i can lvl up more with out them hitting every singe mop.

February 16, 2003 04:51 pm ET (#17)
Tempo
Loyal Fan

55 posts
04-30-02

Do Jello Cubes and Lesser Dragon have that 1 hit death thing still?
someone told me they took out on lesser dragon.. anyone kno?

February 16, 2003 04:54 pm ET (#18)
Cody
Loyal Fan

510 posts
09-10-02

nothing killed my lvl 49 knight in 1 hit...

February 16, 2003 04:55 pm ET (#19)
Cody
Loyal Fan

510 posts
09-10-02

also if these 200a oranges go live thats garbage...i think ill stack up on oranges now...hehe..

February 16, 2003 05:53 pm ET (#20)
Spyfox
Loyal Fan

117 posts
09-20-02

i want jello cubes!!!
theyre strong!!! (and i bet they give very good nutricion ^^)

February 16, 2003 06:12 pm ET (#21)
Doomscythe
Loyal Fan

1155 posts
03-21-02

Lindvior powerful!

February 16, 2003 06:37 pm ET (#22)
WaterElf
LC Reporter

145 posts
11-16-01

pain is v

February 16, 2003 06:47 pm ET (#23)
sisyphus
Loyal Fan

56 posts
05-03-02

Excellent work droid.

One comment for NCI: Havent you realized how stupid forcing people to do things are? You can make potions 1000 adena in Aden. Even George W Bush would have half the intelligence to just have another character stored in another town, close to a dwarf to buy potions for one self. Do what you want NCI. Just try to be a bit more intelligent about how you plan things or, as I suspect, cover up oversights in programming.

February 16, 2003 07:14 pm ET (#24)
celst
Loyal Fan

posts
10-13-02

WoW i can't wait for this. it looks great and i want to see all those clears being pumped when aden castle get seiged, it's going to be sweeet

February 16, 2003 07:25 pm ET (#25)
Jailrune
Loyal Fan

60 posts
05-25-02

http://community.playforum.net:8080/bbs/prog/column?action=read&iid=10051021&kid=3496

http://community.playforum.net:8080/bbs/prog/column?action=read&iid=10051021&kid=3534

look at the second thread more closely.

February 16, 2003 07:32 pm ET (#26)
Elric
Loyal Fan

337 posts
10-29-02

wth? 200@ for orange potions? EVERYWHERE?? if its true.... SUCKS!!!!

February 16, 2003 07:46 pm ET (#27)
Forsaken
Loyal Fan

87 posts
12-14-02

Gooooooooooooooooo, Giants! :E

February 16, 2003 07:52 pm ET (#28)
droidbuilder
Loyal Fan

63 posts
10-11-02

Guys I just wanna make clear the reason for oranges being 200a. With the new castle system other castles will make less and some will make more. To balance this oranges (the common potion) were changed to 200a to generate more income for the castles. Captsturm told me this and I say it is a good idea.

And ha ha ha Amer told you husky was better! :P

February 16, 2003 08:06 pm ET (#29)
McLeans
Loyal Fan

137 posts
09-17-02

Seems like a husky is better if mops hit your dogs...
But if dobs do more damage then I prefer dobs O.o

February 16, 2003 08:42 pm ET (#30)
Elric
Loyal Fan

337 posts
10-29-02

its not a good idea... a knight almost cant afford to pay his hunts with oranges at 125.. at 200?? is crazy, if they want to balance, just remove that 4day-siege -40% taxe -_-

February 16, 2003 08:44 pm ET (#31)
lordgohan
Loyal Fan

64 posts
01-20-02

Good idea to make oranges 200a? thats crap. Increase the drops and they wont have to worry about it. I hunt FV and i take 160 oranges a trip with me each hunt. thats 18k. With aden update thats 30k. that almost 75% price increase.

Guess its about time I find another game to waste my time on, cuz $15 is starting to seem a little expensive to play some old 2d game anyways. Im starting NOT to like the guy that calls himself "Captsturm". Yeah.. brilliant ideas to make everyone mad and quit the game.

February 16, 2003 09:06 pm ET (#32)
b0ts
Loyal Fan

72 posts
01-02-03

they should atleast increase the hp recovery of the oj.

February 16, 2003 09:21 pm ET (#33)
Jdawg6889
Loyal Fan

6 posts
10-11-02

any1 remember when giants were in Lin before?

roaming around desert?

hehe there were so easy, a n00b could kill them with the right amount of pots.

im looking forward to hunting sewers, but i will probably stay away from em for the first few weeks or month or so, because, just about every high lvl person will be there or Tower of Isolence.

=)

February 16, 2003 09:56 pm ET (#34)
ultimaslayer
Loyal Fan

221 posts
06-24-02

ancient giant drops pretty good..well at least on test it does

February 16, 2003 10:57 pm ET (#35)
flexy24k
Loyal Fan

215 posts
12-10-02

How dumb to make ojs that expensive. Most of the castles are owned by the same damn organization anyways. Keep them the same price and let them figure it out. This is gonna make it very difficult for knights to make money on regular hunts now. TERRIBLE idea!!! Like the castle owners need more freakin money...

February 17, 2003 12:42 am ET (#36)
droidbuilder
Loyal Fan

63 posts
10-11-02

Honestly guys can you really complain about inflation? Sure it will effect the live server but life goes on. I remember when they raised the price of coffee at Tim Horten's by 5 cents. You'd swear the Prime Minester had been shot (can you tell I'm Canadian)! Sure 75a is a bit of a increase but it doesn't mean you will quit. Lot's of new items and drops have been incorperated into episode 12. Lesser dragons drop a b dai or b zel almost anytime killed on Test. Thats probably 1/10 on Live and maybe 1/7 on LoA.

Flexy,
Now that the new castle taxation system will be in play castle owners will need more money. If the Aden castle owner decides to give Aden 94% of the pot, Giran 1% of the pot, WW 1% of the pot, Weldern 1% of the pot, Orc Town 1% of the pot, Kent 1% of the pot, Heine 1% of the pot then the extra revinue from orange pots might make a difference.

You all never complain when buying clears to hunt bosses with so don't complain now. I am going to message Captsturm to further ask about a few of my concerns of this Episode before it hits live. As it says "More to come...."

February 17, 2003 01:28 am ET (#37)
WindElf
Loyal Fan

16 posts
12-12-02

First off, I preface these comments by saying I play an elf and so pot use is not a huge issue for me (and when it is, it is usually clears I use, not ojs).

To up the oj price to 200a is yet ANOTHER example of a trend we already see way, way too much in LIneage: the rich get richer and the poor get screwed. How many people in the game own castles? 6? 7? So for the benefit of those ultra elite players (and their ultra elite pledgemates, and very soon, their ultra elite alliances), everybody else in the entire game gets the shaft. Hmmm, that really makes a lot of sense.

And whoever suggested that the fact that the uber mops in ep. 12 drop really well balances this out, is clearly missing the point. Because only the upper, elite players are going to be able to kill these upper level mops to get these drops. So once again, it is the upper crust that gets the benefit. The fact that the ancient giant drops his strength ring, or Lindivior drops lots of zels and dais when ended, doesn't help the lvl 15 knight trying to scrape by a living hunting outside of SKT. If you're going to balance higher oj prices with higher drop rates, you gotta do it in the lower-level hunting areas, not in places like the Twilight Mountains.

Can NC really be serious when they say the reason for this is to make castles more profitable?!? That is such a joke. Of course, there is nothing so un-funny as a joke that you think is just a bad joke until you realize the person who told it to you didn't consider it a joke.

Mark my words: if this stays, it will reduce the "fun factor" for the lower midrange players (it is no fun being so poor you are scraping by a living from one hunt to the next), and since no one wants to play a game that ceases to be fun, the end result will be a further loss of the number of people, especially new people, playing the game. That will hurt the game as a whole, and cost NC money. I hope to God someone at NC wakes up and changes this before we lose even more of our players.

I like Lineage. I like playing it. I want Lineage to keep getting better. This is a step in the wrong direction.

February 17, 2003 02:47 am ET (#38)
K-ZS-M
Loyal Fan

925 posts
05-04-02

I don't buy pots
has no affect on me
I get enough pots on my mage and elf so I use to hunt with my knight

February 17, 2003 02:48 am ET (#39)
Azzere
Loyal Fan

39 posts
12-11-01

i may be wrong but i thing NC is trying to make being in a pledge more apealling and then trying to make seiging more apealing by doing this 200@ ojs

the game is lineage:the blood pledge.... its based on being in a blood pledge and fighting for castles... but i think it lost that view a long time ago

o well... just my 2 cents...

February 17, 2003 03:50 am ET (#40)
WindElf
Loyal Fan

16 posts
12-12-02

Azzere, I think your comments are the most sane explanation I have heard. Thank you for them. Becuase it certainly does follow logically that if you make castles much more appealing (financially), then you would have many more bp's interested in fighting for them, thus more sieging, etc.

The problem is, as much sense as it makes in theory, it simply cannot and will not happen in real life. Why? Because there are so few castles, and so there is a small crowd of uber-powerful bp's that basically constantly keep control of them. The reason there aren't more players involved in sieging is because 95% (or more? maybe 99%) of the blood pledges out there simply are not strong enough to begin even fantasizing about actually taking a castle.

And why is that? The cause is what I said in my first post: because virtually every aspect of the game promotes a "rich get richer" system. This is just as true among pledges as among individual players. I mean, think about it. The pledges that control castles...how many lvl 45+ players? How many 50+? 52+? Now imagine you are JoeNewbiePrince, lvl 20, and you start recruiting for your blood pledge, "FutureCastleOwners". You gonna get too many ppl in dk or de morphs walking up to you offering to join? Of course not. You're gonna get lvl 10's, 20's, if you're *lucky* a few past 30. And there might be excitement at first, but after attending a few sieges (perhaps as a mere spectator), it very quickly becomes obvious to JoeNewbiePrince that there is no way on God's green earth that his pledge is *ever* going to have a shot at doing that. The difference is simply too great to make up. The uber, elite pledges have just too many people with such high levels, incredible ac, incredible weapons, uber items, etc, etc, etc, there is no realistic way (as the game is structured now) for a new pledge to reach that level.

Want a radical suggestion for how to change this? Put a much more effective "ceiling" on character development. Cap lvling at, say, 50 (or maybe even lower). Eliminate all over-zelling and over-daiing. Eliminate the lvl-related stat bonuses. Maybe remove certain highly unbalancing items (coi, for example?) from the game, or else have it such that they don't function in siege zones.

In other words, level the playing field. Make it so that JoeNewbiePrince, with his group of lvl 20's and 30's, could look to the future (9 months or a year down the road) and *realistically* see his bp as one that could rival any of the currently existing ones.

Let me tell you, it would sure spice up the game some, and would add far more drama to the whole sieging aspect of Lineage.

Does it sound unrealistic? Given what Lineage has established, sadly, yes. But other MMORPG's out there have learned from the mistakes Lineage (and others) have made. I was just reading about Shadowbane (scheduled to launch openly Mar. 25), and one thing they emphasize is that there ARE level limits (I believe lvl 60), and that it is a relatively rapid thing to level pretty close to max pretty fast. And they say the reason is so that new players can quickly get up to the point where they are and can be meaningfully "competitive."

As Lineage stands now, the only real hope that the 99% majority out there has is that the ppl (and pledges) in the top 1% lose interest and quit the game, or that the "power" pledges fall apart and the most powerful members of them head off in different directions.

My 2 cents...or 4 cents...whatever. Would love to hear what others think.

February 17, 2003 06:11 am ET (#41)
Azzere
Loyal Fan

39 posts
12-11-01

windelf i agree with you that realisticly a castle would be incredably hard to seige with JoeNewbiePrince's pledge... but just say you are a newbie... u join this pledge at lvl 10 and you seige, you win (dont ask how) your a newb that pretty much just completed the game... and would most likely get bored of the game alot quicker then someone with a goal of getting to lvl 45+ and being able to seige like a pro...
the point im trying to make is NC want it to take "(9 months or a year down the road)" to have a strong enough pledge to seige.... they make more money that way... the longer your playing the more money they make and they are trying to increase your goals i guess... anyway im running out of cents so i leave now

February 17, 2003 07:24 am ET (#42)
Kill you
Loyal Fan

46 posts
04-09-02

if you cant lv past 50 and cant over enchant.. what will keep you in the game when you cant do anything to get better

i like how you see things but i dont agree with ur solution

February 17, 2003 11:31 am ET (#43)
SpysLikeUs
Loyal Fan

89 posts
03-04-02

Amer, thanks again for your excellent coverage of e12 thus far,
and your thoughtful [comment] about new dog vs. doberman.

I'd hate to wake up tomorrow and
find my lvl.4x beta doberman's
are suddenly worthless.

February 17, 2003 02:20 pm ET (#44)
wandoc
Loyal Fan

12 posts
07-02-02

My 2 Cents.

I agree that this is going to be a very interesting update to the game, and the idea of have a new, large area to explore is something that Ihave been looking forward to now sence the original anouncement of EP. 12.

I also think that some one at NCsoft thought that they had a great idea to help make up for the COST of the new Castle Tax system that they are introducing and they were just following the example that the system that this game is set on would use. If the smaller castles have to start giving money to a larger castle they they will raise the cost of items to make up for the lost revenue.

The one thing that I think most of the people at NCsoft failed to take into consideration is that when this happend in history, it wasnt long before the lower class people that had to bear the brunt of the increase in cost, the lowwer classes rose up and Killed the leaders. People like Robin Hood were borne from this type of problems. Also the entire type of leadership changed from a monarcy to something different.

Now, In the game this is not possible, and so the rich are in control. But if something cant be done then People will stop playing and there for KILL the game.

I think that if NC really wants to increase the income to the castle owners inorder to offset this NEW tax system then maybe they should just increase the drop rate on all of the monsters by 1% across the board. In this way people will have more money to buy things with, without becoming super rich, the income of the castles will increase enough to offset the new system. The players will be making a little more money and there fore be happy to spend more. The lower level player/newbee players will be able to aford to hunt and continue to play this ever expanded game and move forward to the more expensive items.

I remember when I was a newb player and I got started. It seemed like everything cost a fortune to get. but I knew that as my character got better I would be able to support myself and get the better items. I am now 45+ and my knight does ok. I have been able to save money to get some of the nicer things in the game.

As some of you remember thou, When Oren came into the game the cost of Oranges when you, but only there. I dont know about those people that hunt in that area, but I just plane do not buy pots there because of the cost. I also will not buy Orange pots for 150a, like it is in Silver Knight Town or Talking Island.

So, do I think this is a good thing, No way. And it could be the end of me continuing to play this game. Lin2 is coming as well as others.

We will See.

And that is my 2 cents.

February 17, 2003 03:19 pm ET (#45)
WindElf
Loyal Fan

16 posts
12-12-02

Okay, for a completely different idea...maybe even more impractical (and thus dumb), but who knows, I'll throw it out and see.

Think about deathmatches. One of the nice things about them is that they are divided roughly by level. That way newer and mid-level characters can have the fun and excitment (and exp loss...) of a dm without suffering either because super high lvl chars killing everything, or else NC putting in mops appropriate to lvl 50 playres ina lvl 20 dm. I think ppl of those levels enjoy having something that is "their thing" that is just as dramatic and adrenaline-filled as the lvl 45+ dm.

What if you could do something similar with castles and sieges?

Maybe make a few more castles in the game (would that be hard? I don't know.) And set aside a few of them as "mid-level" type castles, so that the uber pledges couldn't siege. How would you do that? One of two ways. In the first way, by an individual class ceiling: say that no character over lvl 40 (or whatever) would be allowed in the siege zone at all during siege. If they walk into it, they woudl be immeidately tele'd to nearest town. This would be my vote.

Second way would be not individual character ceiling but pledge ceiling. Say add up all the levels of everyone in the pledge, and that number cannot exceed a certain amount. The reason I don't like this as much is because, as we know, when a pledge is sieging (or defending), they tend to often have many others helping who are not in the pledge. So I think this rule would be a lot easier to get around then my first suggestion.

Anyway, another 2 or 3 cents worth.

And Azerre, I agree with you completley, that NC needs to have something to keep people playing the game. It's a tough balance...how do you design a world that allows newbies to have fun such that they want to continue, while veterans are still feeling like they have more theyy could accomplsih even after playing for a year or more? I'm not sure anyone (including NC) really has the answer to that question. But it's been fun throwing around ideas here on this thread.

February 17, 2003 06:55 pm ET (#46)
Moo
Loyal Fan

42 posts
02-13-03

WoW,
Where do I start?

There have been many posts worthy for any & everyone's reading. Especially Windelf's comments. I really do not understand what the problem is for oj's being 200a, of course I am not a knight so obviously my opion is biased from and elf's perspective.

I must admit that I although I have not played for very long I myself am lvl 45+, simply due to the fact that I only concentrate on one character. I have not seen all the wonders of Lineage yet, but I have played many an RPG, especially MUDs, and I believe what NC soft is doing is a good idea. I feel for those new players who do not have the money to buy potions, but think about it... These so called "Uber-elites" have worked countless hours to make their characters high level. That is the whole point isn't it? To make your characters powerful and dominant. So my point is, NCsoft is adhering to those that have worked hard and accomplished what few have - and probably few will.
The reason I say this is a good idea is because when I used to play a particular MUD (name undisclosed) I reached the pinacle of a player's dream. I reached level 54, which made me an elite player. So all was well untill they did an update and all the "Elite" players got the $#!T end of the stick. Everyone who was new complained about this and that, and the Immortals (like Monitors I suppose) gave in to the wishes of the new players. This may seem like a good thing but all 11 of us "Elites" had the worst thing happen to us. We each had items that pretty much compare with the likes of COI's and +9B-Tsus, which we tried direly hard to get, only to have such items made so common that at level 25 or so a player could rival a level 50+. It really hurt us as all of what we worked for was just handed over so easily for the likes of the new players. So my point is that as being "Elite" wasn't of any importance anymore we, the 11 elite, lost interest in the game. Most of us left and the world I would imagine was recycled.
I understand that that case was an extreme but, to cater to the newer players all the time is unfair and will most likely result in the loss of the more experienced players. Hence why I believe that NCsoft is helping the "Uber" players keep interest.
That being said this is just my humble opinion, and I will take no offence to criticism and I would be glad to hear some other spin with regards to my comments!!!
~Mooooooooooo!~


Oh, BTW, isn't there a new system where a player lvl10+ can vote for a Mayor or something for a certain town, and then that mayor would give a sum of money to the players or something like that? Wouldn't that help for the cause of paying for Ojs??? I am not too sure whether what I am saying in this after thought is credible so please don't hold it against me. Just figured it might be worth bringing up if it is in fact legit!!!!

February 17, 2003 07:24 pm ET (#47)
MrMog
Loyal Fan

0 posts
11-07-02

what would win in a duel... 15 Gel cubes vs 1 ancient giant? all at once~

February 18, 2003 12:22 am ET (#48)
UltimateOne
Loyal Fan

41 posts
10-31-02

Heres a better idea.
Why not just give the money to the castls without havign anythign to do with taxes. Like an aditional 100k per castle plus teh taxes

Meaningless posts will be deleted. You don't have to post on *every* article. ^^

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